Tire Balancing

I'm planning on joining the Darkside soon. I have a friend that ownes a tire shop and he said that he can't balance a motorcycle rim. Does it really have to be balanced. Why couldn't he do it? Does a car tire break-down machine not work for a motorcycle rim?

Yes, a car tire machine (for mag wheels) will work on the MC rim. He can't balance it because the hole in the center of the rim is too small to get on his spin balancer.

Yes, it needs to be balanced...you can use a product like balancing beads or you can static balance it (stick it on the axle, on stands, and spin lightly...wherever it stops the heavy spot is down, add some weight at the top and try again). It takes patience, but is easy to do.

Dynabeads is the ultimate solution, but you can't put them in right after you seat the bead if you used a lot of vegetable oil in the process. this would cause the dynabeads to clump, and not work.

David taught me this trick:
Put the axle through the rim. Balance the axle on paint cans. Needs to be level.
Give it a spin and mark the bottom. Repeat 3 times to see that the same place comes to rest at the bottom. (If the bottom is random, your tire is balanced and nothing else is required)
Put an ounce of stick on weights directly opposite the mark.
Spin again several times to see what spot comes to the bottom. Make numerical marks.
Add weight as required.
When the "bottom" is random, the tire is balanced and ready to install.

Aftter 500 miles, the vegetable oil disapporates. remove the stick on weights and install dynabeads.

I think I have some pictures of this process in the VT1100 section. We documented the entire tire replacement process. Good luck.

Thanks for the info guys, I'm ready for the long milage out of a tire! :cyclops:

I don't advocate this only because I haven't done it yet! But Gitchemo is using zinc coated BB's in his tires and I am going to try it next! He used the same amount of oz.'s that's required of the Dyna beads and it seems to work.

I met him last nite on his way to NC from Acapulco Mexico and no problems reported from him from the bb's. As a matter of fact he had to replace his front tire on the way and NO RUST on the bb's!... But his rear tire is still going....and going!


.....................bobby

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BIGT FROM F.B. wrote:Thanks for the info guys, I'm ready for the long milage out of a tire! :cyclops:

What you should really be ready for is the AWESOME ride and the GRIP you will have.. We promise you won't be dissapointed!

twin1300 wrote:I don't advocate this only because I haven't done it yet! But Gitchemo is using zinc coated BB's in his tires and I am going to try it next! He used the same amount of oz.'s that's required of the Dyna beads and it seems to work.

Keep us posted on the zinc coated BBs. I'd like to hear how they look when the tire is changed.

this might help :
http://www.clarity.net/~adam/tire-changing-doc.html

after removing the old tirefrom the rim, I cleaned the rim with steel wool and soap and water to get the gummy part of the old tire out of the wheels bead area , then checked for the heavy part of the rim, and marked it , then i put the tire on so the light part of the tire and heavy mark of the rim lined up and when i had the bead seated i checked for balance ,
I didn't have to do much it was close and all it needed was for me to cut a little off the wheel weight and move it around untill it was just right . took about 15 min and it worked great.never wobbled even at high speeds.
Good luck,
Horse

Thanks guys, I ended up with a BF Goodrich Traction T/A 205/60/16. Found a Cycle Gear in Lawrenceville Ga where the people are always rude and act like you shouldn't be there, but they balanced my tire for free!!! The lady that balanced it was asking me why I didn't like being able to turn corners. I guess 600+ people need to prove her wrong. Not to mention all the guys on the VTXOA.com that run the darkside

I have to ask this.
Why put the beads in the tire after going to all the trouble of balancing the tire with lead weights? And, how are you going to rebalance the tire at a later date? I surely plan to rebalance after 10K miles. It prevents cupping and makes the tire last longer. Am I right?

When I change my tire, I use a lot of veggie oil. If I put dynabeads in immediately, they would clump and not work. So, I use sticky weights for the first 500 miles or so. After that, I pull the weights off and put dynabeads in.

If you use dynabeads, your tires remain balanced for the life of the tire. No rebalancing required.

It's just my 2 cents but I use Jack stands to hold the axle for static balancing. You can put the axle on by it's self and get thim level then put the tire on and go.....Just my 2 cents.

What kind of magic spell are you guys using with your jewjew beads? Magic beads balancing your tire for LIFE? Comon guys. Whats next?
How come the they are secretely only used in motorcycle tires? How come tire shops arent installing them in cars?
Im not buying it,I'll take the lead weights any day.

Have you never seen the outer rings with balls in them used on semi wheels for balance they use centrifical force every time your wheel starts turning the balls balance them ,same principal HELLO come on guy. Ride Safe Larry S.

First off most semi truck wheels arent balanced.
Second, using the jew jew beads are guess work unless you know exactly how much to put in. Im not saying they cant work.
Third, as the tire begins to wear it changes its balance point and how much weight it requires to keep it balanced.
Fourth, if you get a flat it changes the weight requirement and balance point if you patch or plug the tire and remount the tire on the rim.
Comon guys, this is basic stuff. And a bottle of BB's aint gonna cut it.

this is to Funny ! semi truck steering tires are balanced.but i dont know i was an owner operator.i dont know about BB'sfor balancing .the ppl here in mpls,mn.the dyno beed deal asks what size tires so you get the correct weight .

I too was an operator. Never had the tires balanced. But understand this, I dont care about the beads. Use them, be happy, I am, with my lead wheel weights. Discussion over.

wow a ltle touchy to have someone disagree with ya i guess lol .no biggy ride in peace.

Since you didnt address my points I made above your wasting time here.

The real issue here is again we have someone with no pryor experience telling the ones of us with experience with the dynabeads that they won't work.Sounds vagely familiar ,wonder what it was that has had same effect on other boards

Your a fool.

starider wrote:Your a fool.

While intelligent people can often simplify the complex, a fool is more likely to complicate the simple.
Author: Gerald W. Grumet
It's basic physics.

It is true most owner operators do not use balance beads for their tires. However the larger trucking companies that can afford such things and have their own fleet mechanics do use them.
I know for a fact that J.B. Hunt uses balance beads their trailer tires. Larger companies use them because the potential monetary risk of lawsuit is greater than the cost of the balance beads. It also has been proven to extend the life of the tire and compensate for tire wear (especially on retreads) which also saves them hundreds of thousands of dollars per year.
The beads come in a plastic bag that is sealed with a small clip or, more commonly, closed with glue. The bags are thrown in the tire before mounting. Once the tire starts rolling the plastic and the glue come apart and the beads are released into the tire. Eventually the plastic is pulverized by the beads until there is virtually nothing left. The tires then balance themselves via centrifugal force.

Dynabeads are the most recent kid on the block with a ceramic bead. The ceramic bead does not become abrasive as it wears down.
The other two types of beads that hold patents are metal and glass beads.
The glass beads biggest drawback is that they tend to clog the air stem because they deteriorate into a fine powder that makes remounting a tire a pain. The drawback of the metal beads is that over time the beads wear on one another and eventually are no longer round and become abrasive, actually reducing the life of the tire from the inside-out.

Beads of any nature are not designed to be in a tire for too long. Eventually they will break down and need to be replaced. In the case of trucks the tires are usually replaced before this is an issue. (Especially trailer tires)
In the case of personal vehicles, tires typically aren't designed to last as long and are replaced before this is an issue.

If it were my bike I would not use metal beads in a tire because of the chance they may be too abrasive for the inside of the tire and could potentially wear out the tire from the inside out.

Here is a demonstration of how balance beads work: Dyno Beads Demo

To further clarify I will address each of your points:

First off most semi truck wheels arent balanced.

Not entirely true. Most owner/operator semi wheels are not balanced. But a lot more big companies are balancing tires to prolong tire life and reduce potential lawsuits from "road gator" blowouts.

Second, using the jew jew beads are guess work unless you know exactly how much to put in. Im not saying they cant work.

Also not true... it doesn't have to be an exact science. As long as you know the approximate weight and size of tire you can just out in a pre-measured amount in a tire based on it's size. A little extra is always better than not enough in this case.

Third, as the tire begins to wear it changes its balance point and how much weight it requires to keep it balanced.

You are absolutely right. However centrifugal force will automatically adjust and distribute the beads as the tire balance changes. That is the physics part.

Fourth, if you get a flat it changes the weight requirement and balance point if you patch or plug the tire and remount the tire on the rim.

Only by a few ounces. And as long as you have enough beads it won't matter. It would take several pounds of redistributed weight to throw th tire off enough to counter the effect of the beads. (In which case you don't really have an intact tire). Also whenever the tire is taken off of the rim the beads should be replaced. If the tire jut needs a plug then the beads are more than capable of compensating for the weight.

Comon guys, this is basic stuff. And a bottle of BB's aint gonna cut it

You're right about it being basic stuff, but beads will do the trick quite nicely.
Here is a good link to exactly how the balancing works: How it works

Steve-O wrote:Dynabeads is the ultimate solution, but you can't put them in right after you seat the bead if you used a lot of vegetable oil in the process. this would cause the dynabeads to clump, and not work.

David taught me this trick:
Put the axle through the rim. Balance the axle on paint cans. Needs to be level.
Give it a spin and mark the bottom. Repeat 3 times to see that the same place comes to rest at the bottom. (If the bottom is random, your tire is balanced and nothing else is required)
Put an ounce of stick on weights directly opposite the mark.
Spin again several times to see what spot comes to the bottom. Make numerical marks.
Add weight as required.
When the "bottom" is random, the tire is balanced and ready to install.

Aftter 500 miles, the vegetable oil disapporates. remove the stick on weights and install dynabeads.

I think I have some pictures of this process in the VT1100 section. We documented the entire tire replacement process. Good luck.

There is another solution and I have used it often. First you don't need to overly lube the tire bead to seat the tire. After the tire has bee seated let the air out of the tire and break the bead in one spot. Insert a ??5/8 doll rod to hold an opening.
If your using BBs's filler bottle that has the short clear tube on the end insert it into the opening and let the beads pour in. Clean off any excessive beads and reseat the tire and fill...check for leaks. Simple